Exploring Sardinian Wine with Nikki Dickerson (Part 1)

Ep 96

When you think of islands in Italy, you probably think of Sicily, but what about the lesser known island of Sardinia?

Today, Nikki and I are diving into the geography of Sardinia which lends itself to a diverse tapestry of wine styles. We’ll introduce you to a variety of grape varietals, including Cannonau, Vermentino, Malvasia and Cagnulari.

From being home to one of the world’s Blue Zones, to challenges like navigating Italy’s complex regulations and unpredictable weather that killed 1/3 of her vines, you’ll learn what sets the island's lifestyle apart. 

Nikki is an international wine marketer turned vigneron, writer, and (if all goes well) soon-to-be wine importer, living between the U.S. and Sardinia, Italy. After a life-changing trip to France in 2018, she left the corporate PR world for wine country, chasing harvests across California, Australia, Burgundy, and beyond. Along the way, she met her husband, an Italian winemaker, and together they planted their first vineyards in Sardinia—laying the foundation for their dream winery.

Now, through Sip with Nik, she shares her wine-soaked adventures, from discovering hidden-gem bottles to navigating the wild world of winemaking and wine imports. Whether you're looking for your next favorite wine, dreaming of vineyard life, or just here for a great story, she’s got a glass for you.

So, if you are ready to learn about the complexity and richness of Sardinia’s wine culture, dive into the lesser known indigenous grape varieties, and hear Nikki’s first hand insights and passion for Sardinia, then this episode is for you!

Resources and Connect with Nikki:

30% off annual Sip with Nik Substack subscription plans - https://sipwithnik.substack.com/corkandfizz 

Sip with Nik Substack: https://sipwithnik.substack.com/

Sip with Nik Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/sipwithnik/

Vernaccia di Oristano – Sardinia’s Most Fascinating Wine - https://sipwithnik.substack.com/p/vernaccia-di-oristano-sardinias-most?r=43xhvk&utm_medium=ios&triedRedirect=true

Geology map of Sardinia - https://www.pconti.net/doc/Sard-Geol-tjom.pdf

Episode Highlights:

• Nikki Dickerson’s journey into wine
• Importance of Sardinia’s regions and wine grape varieties
• Challenges of starting a winery in Sardinia
• What is the blue zone in Sardinia
• An ov

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Transcript

0:09

Interested in learning about wine, but not sure where to start? You're in the right place. Welcome to the Cork and Fizz Guide to Wine podcast. I'm your host, Haley Bullman, and I'm so glad you're here. I'm a wine enthusiast turned wine educator and founder of the Seattle based wine tasting business Cork and Fizz. It is my goal to build your confidence in wine by making it approachable and lots of fun. You can expect to learn everything from how to describe your favorite wine to what to pair with dinner tonight and so much more. Whether you're a casual wine sipper or a total cork dork like myself, this podcast is for you. So, grab yourself a glass and let's dive in. Hello, and welcome back to the Cork and Fizz Guide to Wine podcast. I am so excited to introduce you today to Nikki Dickerson. You may also know her as sipwithnick on Instagram. Nikki is an international wine marketer turned vigneron, winemaker, or is it a winemaker's vigneron the same thing as winemaker? And she's also planted vines. So all of the above. She's also a writer. And if all goes well in her words, a soon to be wine importer. I have no doubts. And she lives between The US and Sardinia, Italy, which is what we're going to be talking about today. But more about Nikki, after a life changing trip to France in 2018, she left the corporate PR world for wine country chasing harvest across California, Australia, Burgundy, and beyond. Along the way, she met her husband, an Italian winemaker, and together they planted their first vineyards in Sardinia, laying the foundation for their dream winery. Now through her blog or Substack, as I have come to learn, Sip with Nick, she shares her wine soaked adventures from discovering hidden gem bottles to navigating the wild world of wine making and wine imports. Personally, I've been following Nikki and her journey for years on Instagram. I loved following her journey of planting grapes in Sardinia with her husband and always look forward to her post sharing unique and lesser known wine rattle. Honestly, that's like the thing that I started following her for was like all these hidden gem, unique wines that she talked about. And then she started talking about planting vines in Sardinia and I'm like, oh my gosh, this girl is so cool. So Nikki actually came and spoke to my court crew virtual tasting club a few months back. And I knew that if she was willing, I had to get her on this podcast for the Italian mini series. Knowledge on Sardinian wines is fairly limited around the world. So getting to hear firsthand from Nikki about the wine and the grapes grown here, grown there in Sardinia is just so, so special. So I'm really excited for you get to hear this episode. Now, again, these interviews are split into two episodes. So you're gonna be hearing part one of our interview today. This art will be talking about a little bit about Nikki's journey into the world of wine, how she found herself in Sardinia. And then she gives us a really nice overview of the regions of Sardinia along with talking about the different grapes that are grown there. I should have in the show notes as well for you a map that Nikki sent that shows off the geography of Sardinia. So you can kind of follow along as long as you're not like driving or doing something else while she talks about the geography. But anyway, enough of me, let's jump into the interview. But yay. I'm excited to talk about Sardinia with you. It's gonna be very, very fun, but I always like to give you a chance. So kind of diving in the first question is always like, who are you and how did you discover your passion for wine? I feel like who are you is always such a philosophical. I know, right? I know a lot. Professionally, I've been a wine, marketing and public relations professional for the last six or so years now. Now I would say recently initiated Vinuron with my husband, Marco, but I'm also a writer, both, you know, freelance. I have my own blog and newsletter, which we'll talk about, but I love traveling. I love just experiencing as much of life as possible. I'm a huge fan of music and art, so I'm just trying to live it up as much as possible while I can. I love it. Okay. And then tell us how you fell in love with wine. How did you discover a passion for wine? It was I think I was probably in my, like, mid to late twenties. I grew up in California, in Southern California, and, my parents had moved to Washington state. And my mom was not a fan of the weather there after living in, like, sunny Southern California. So Yeah. It's definitely different here. That's for sure. Yeah. They, lucky for me, ended up getting a home in Passover Bowls in Central Coast, California. So I started, it's not too far obviously from Southern California. So I started going up there for wine tastings on most weekends increasingly so a little bit at first. And that was kind of how I first got introduced to the world of wine. But I think what really, set me off on that path and when I dove in head first was when I went to Europe and I visited the Southern Rhone Valley. And I went on a really special wine tour with this man named Mike, who if anyone listening ever needs a tour guide in the Southern Rhone Valley, his thing is Mike's wine safari. He is fantastic. And he takes you in we went into wine cellars. We visited, like, three different appellations in the Southern Rhone. And then after that trip, I was like, okay. I'm this is what I wanna do. I wanna be living this kind of life because I realized wine really is kind of like a life style almost. So Right. I quit my job in San Diego and moved to Paso Robles to work in a tasting room of all things and got going from there. Wow. Well, first of all, Mike's Wine Safari. That name, I feel like I see it and I'd be like, really? But I appreciate the recommendation for it, so now I know if it ever comes across. I know. And also, like, once you if you see his branding, it's you definitely would not think it is, like, the high professional standard of service that you really get on the trip. But, I mean, I can I can't recommend them enough? And I That's a diamond in the rough. Yeah. Totally. And we've kept in touch since then. And that was, what, 2016, '20 '17? Oh, great. So, yeah. Oh, well, I'm gonna have to I feel like I'm gonna have to reach out to Mike of Mike's Wine Safari. He's just about the northern ground. It'd be fun. Okay. So you quit your job, your corporate job, and then you start working in tasting rooms in Paso Robles. Yes. How did you get from that to now starting a winery on the island of Sardinia in like, why Sardinia? Right? How did you get there? It seems like such a leap and it's on this. Whenever I tell people, they're like, can you try to book or something? I'm like, it just seems normal to me. So I was working in Paso at Adelaide Vineyards and Winery, which is my favorite still, winery in Paso Robles. And I decided I wanted to work harvest, like work in the cellar wine making so I could experience wine making firsthand. And we had a really cute Italian intern that showed up to do harvest as well. And we just hit it off and fell in love. And now we're married. His name's Marco and he is actually from Sardinia. He would not be happy if I was telling you he's Italian. Sardinians like to be called Sardinian. They're very proud of their island. And so like, that was 2018 when we worked that harvest and we went to Australia together after that because we had just met. We spent four months together. We were like, where can we go? That we could both get a visa Yeah. And work together. So we decided to do a harvest in Australia in McLaren Vale. And obviously, they're on the other side of there in the Southern Hemisphere. So it was perfect. We finished harvest and started another, which was exhausting, but I guess, well, worth it. Yeah. Goodness. Wow. Harvest is hard enough. Just one and then follow it up. I know. I was like, I don't know if I wanna do this. He's like, it'll be fine. And then it was a massive custom crush facility also, which was we went from a 300 ton harvest at this awesome boutique winery in California to a three no. 6,000 ton custom crush harvest that lasted forever. So it was different experiences, very much so. But anyways, long story short, we ended up getting married, like, a year, a year and a half later. And then we lived in Burgundy, France together for two years. He got a job at in in Burgundy. And then I remember, like, over I don't know when it was. Somewhere in those years when we were back visiting Sardinia, he took me to the spot that was his family's property in the village where his family's family. So one day I wanna plant a vanyard here. I'm like, oh, yeah. Okay. I could see that. And then a year and a half later, we were starting the process to do exactly that. And we planted our vineyards in 2020 what what year are we now? Twenty twenty five, '20 '20 '2? No. I ever since 2020, my years are all messed up. They're all it's like, I still write 20. I mean, it I think each time I write the year, I write a different year when I'm writing it down. I'm like, wait. What is it again? I know. So yeah. So no. It was '20 we're in 2025. So it was the beginning of twenty twenty three when we actually planted our vineyards. And hopefully, this year will be the first year that we're able to make wine from Oh, that's so exciting. That's so fun. I love how it, like, went from, like I think when I think of, like, one day I wanna do this, I'm thinking, like, twenty, thirty years in the past, and you guys were like, one day we're gonna do this. In, like, two years, we're gonna make this happen. We are very fortunate that his first of all, it's his, you know, land that's been within his family for generations. So first of all, we didn't it's not like we had to buy land. Fair. And they also wanted to invest their time and their money with us and all of their energy, and they've been very supportive because obviously, I mean, we're in America now. Like, we've been going back and forth, so they really have taken care of things while we're gone. So it's been a family effort, which is just kind of how they do things in Italy in general, I feel like. So, I mean, we're very lucky that we have the support to make that happen. And my husband's a winemaker. He studied enology. He's worked in wineries all over the world, and it's really, like, been his strength for a long time. And I bring, like, the sales marketing side. So it was kinda it just kind of worked out. Yeah. Absolutely. No. I love it. Just a quick reminder, you are not on my mailing list yet. What are you waiting for? I would love for you to join. When you do, you'll get a free shopping guide that has 15 of my favorite wines under $15. Head to corkandfizz.com, scroll down to the bottom, and there'll be a little section where you can join the mailing list. I send out a weekly newsletter filled with wine tips, recommendations, special offers, and so much more. Now let's get back to the show. I'm curious too from your side now that you've been to Sardinia as much as you have, you know, and obviously, the inspiration was, like, your husband's from there. They your family has land there. What is it that you love about the island that also or maybe was there anything else about the island that you love that inspired you to wanna also be part of the winery experience? Sardinia is such a unique place. It's very much untouched by time still. Like, they're very they live the slow life there. I guess you could put it that way, which is honestly I think we all kind of need to go back a little bit like that because you're at family get togethers and there's people that are that are, like, 70, 80, 90 years old and they're still with it, you're like, okay. They must be doing something right here. So first of all, just like the slower appreciation for life, I really enjoyed. It's one of the most beautiful places I think I've ever been. I mean, like, Sardinia really has the top beaches in the world. I grew up in California. You can't really go wrong. You're having gorgeous beaches in the Mediterranean, but it's also not just like a laid Back Beach Island because they have everything. They have mountains. It it even snows there sometimes in the mountains. They have cities, obviously, a lot more like small, charming villages and towns. The food is amazing. And just the quality of life, I think, is what really drew me in. And then wine wise, I remember the first time I went there, I was like, I was tasting varieties. Of course, everyone knows about Canada now and Vermentino, but I was tasting other wines that I'd never even heard of, and they were so good. And the wines were so affordable. I'm like, how does no one know about this yet? Like, it just seemed like such a hidden gem to me. Yes. And I think that they honestly prefer it that way because it's not I mean, it gets touristy in the summer, and it's a a lot of Europeans, especially, and now more so Americans. But people from France or, you know, Italy spend their summers there. But outside of summer, it's very there's not a lot There's a lot of people there. I mean, they have a big population, but it's not overcrowded. It's not like you would, I think, imagine it to be Right. Right. It's like they they like the hidden part of that gem, hidden gem. Exactly. The hidden gem, they would like to keep it hidden. Well, we gotta talk a little bit about other amazing wine, but I did also you talked about, you know, like that being at the family get togethers, there's folks who are older. And Sardinia is actually known as one of the blue zones of the world, but I feel like people are so intrigued by this idea. You know, it's a place where people typically live longer, and especially as a place that drinks wine on the regular too. I know you mentioned, like, just kind of, like, slowing down is, like, a key thing you notice there. Is there anything else you notice, like, from visiting that, like, to you could kind of explain why this area is a blue zone? Yeah. I mean, I think it's been studied. So, like, these things are proven, but I think once you if you spend more than just two, you know, two weeks, if you spent a month there, you would be able to be immersed more and you would get it too. It's just the way it it's the way of life, the mentality. I mean, the slower living, they all sit you gotta sit down for lunch every day, usually with your family or at least friends. It's the close knit communities because the obviously, like, the towns, the villages are smaller, and you have people that have lived there their whole lives, but they you're going out and you're seeing people people stop in the street and, you know, chat. It's just you're integrated into a community, so you always have that support, whether it's with your family or friends or just, you know, the neighbors. That is a huge thing in Sardinia that especially coming from America where everyone is, like, you know, eating lunch while they're working or, like, I think we're We're just so much more isolated and like rushing through everything, and they really like to stay connected and take things slower. They're also very active, like people of all ages and not just active. Like I go to the gym and I'm going running More so in a sense, you know, they're walking more or they're, like, out in their own vineyard or taking care of their own gardens or, you know, just moving physically daily is a huge thing. And their diet is very actually kind of plant forward in Sardinia. Even though they're an island, you would think that they eat a lot of seafood, like if they do Sicily, but Sardinia has more of a pastoral culture. So a lot of like sheep herding, a lot of, you know, herds of cows. They eat a lot of meat in Sardinia. Interesting. And that's like I feel like that's kind of, like, considered, like, the, like, we shouldn't, we're not a food podcast, but I'm so curious because, like, I feel like typically you think Blue Zone healthy diet is a lot of the, like, seafood, like you said, lighter meats and and the fact that they're eating. But like you said, it's probably, like, it's not processed. They're also having, like, a healthy amount of wine that is totally, like, a naturally made wine in the sense that there's nothing added, no chemicals, no processing. And I think that connection is, like, such a key part that I think Totally. Tend to kind of bypass and not worry about, but that's I I call it out because it's also cool because I think wine creates connection as well and kind of encourages us to sit down at the table together. Definitely. And I don't say that like, I wouldn't say they eat meat every day. You know? They eat meat maybe, like, once or twice a week. But like you said, it's that the meat is, like, it's so good because it's responsibly raised. Like, they're they're just out grazing. There's no it's very minimal human intervention in all aspects in the food and in the wine. And then of course, like the I think the number one thing is their their daily glass of canal because they really drink wine every day. And it's not that they drink in excess. It's a lot of them, or at least my in laws, will just drink it in, like, a regular, you know, water glass. Just give me my like, at lunch, at dinner, your little glass of wine. And they've studied Kental now, and it's multiple health benefits. But the biggest one is that it has a higher concentration of I always say it wrong. I think it's resveratrol. Okay. It's a polyphenol that's found in the grape skins. And it's, like, great for brain function, great for heart health, a bunch of other benefits. And specifically in Canada now, which is Grenache for anyone that doesn't help, but it's Grenache that's indigenous to the island of Sardinia. They've studied it. I was gonna say, I'm sure your husband would also not love if you were just like, Kinna now is Grenache. And he's like, no, no, no. Hold on. No. %. But it is helpful for those who are new to to understand that. And we'll definitely, definitely get into the grapes. But, yeah, I do love that idea. I'm always very careful to be like, keep in mind, wine is not healthy just on its own. It is alcohol. But if you're gonna drink it, like, you might as well grab one. Yeah. A little out of it. And drink the right stuff. I love it. Okay. I wanna dive into a little bit about I think for a lot of people, they might hear, like I mean, first, you describing this island sounds amazing, then be like, oh, starting a winery. That must be so dreamy and wonderful. And I have a feeling there's probably a lot of challenges, that go with it. You probably we don't have all day, so we can't list them all. But do you wanna share, like, a couple things, couple major challenges that you went through starting the winery? Yeah. Definitely. And you're right. That is what most people say, like, when I've talked to people about it. And it's true. And it it has been dreamy, but there have been massive challenges. I think the first thing as an American going into Italy and, like, experiencing this is that there is so much bureaucracy in Italy. And because you're dealing with an, well, first of all, an island, but it's Italy in general, they had a lot of over planting decades ago of vineyards, and they had to take a lot of vineyards out. So now you have to get approved for basically a quota, how many hectares and specifically like how many vines of each variety you're going to plant. So it's very down to the detail. And anyone who's ever tried to do anything at a government office in Italy will know that you need a glass of wine before you go because you need massive amounts of patience to deal with all of the bureaucracy and the steps to make that happen. But, I mean, my husband thankfully did handle most of that since he is Italian. So, you know, they come, they survey the land, they check things afterwards to make sure that you planted what you said. So that was a challenge. We also have, which we'll probably talk about later, we have two vineyard sites, and one of them is up in the mountains. And it's an area that is so rocky. Like, we had to use, like, bulldozers, tractors to take out massive stones from the vineyard. And then even after we planted, we were in there with his dad who is almost 80 years old. And we were taking out Matt. Like, you could pick them up with one or two people by by our hands, like removing rocks because you have to be able to work the land. So that was physically challenging. And then we also have the last thing I'll say was we had devastating, weather the first year after we planted. And that's, like, the most critical year because your babies are trying to, like, take root in the ground. And there was unseasonable storms, like, not typical at the end of summer that were, like, torrential downpours. And our Valley vineyard site obviously is in the valley at the base of a mountain, and there was flooding like they've haven't seen in years. And about, like, a one third of our vineyard flooded and just killed those wines. Oh my god. We had drainage issues, which have since been resolved. So, yeah, that was heartbreaking after you spent years, like, trying to make it happen and spending thousands and thousands of dollars, and then you just have to do it. Yeah. And then you're just like and it's just mother nature has just decided, like, my I feel like we've made it through all the other challenges, but there's nothing I can do about what mother nature has decided. Exactly. And that's the beauty of making wine, but also, like, you're kind of gambling. I mean Yeah. People that have, like, invested their lives in making wine and planting vineyards. I mean, you really it is up to mother nature every year. So which was what makes it exciting also and unique. Like, it's what makes a wine special. I feel like that's the one that I love about wine where I'm like, it's because it's like, this one's different than the one it was last year because, you know, the the but then, yeah, like you said, as a winemaker, I could never I don't think I could ever do it. I I have to, like, I'm terrible without having control. And so, like, to be a winemaker where, like, your entire, like, a crop and your entire product relies on something that you have absolutely zero control. A %. A %. And it's definitely hard from, like, starting from scratch. Like, just, you know, not like we purchased vineyards. You're starting from planting the grafted vines in the ground or an ungrafted, whichever. But, yeah, it's been a process. It's been an adventure, but we've enjoyed all of it, even the stressful part. So At least now you can say that. Right? Yeah. Exactly. Back. Don't ask me don't ask me right after it happened. Okay. So before we dive into more about your winery, I wanna cover a little bit of general knowledge on Sardinia for folks who are kinda like, you keep saying Sardinia. It's an island in Italy, but I know nothing else about it. Can you start with maybe, like, going over the geography of Sardinia and maybe describing if there are some kind of subregions within the island? 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Simply head to corkandfizz.com slash free class pass to get your class pass and be one step closer to becoming a member of the best wine tasting club around, the Cork Crew. I can't wait to see you there. Now let's get back to the show. There are subregions. The geography is pretty complex. They I don't know if it translates in English, but they kind of call it its own continent because there's so many different soil types. And I was gonna send you I didn't have time before, but I have a geological map of Sardinia, and it shows all of the different soils that they have. Oh, great. Yeah. If you wanna send it, I'll send it. I'll put a link in the show notes for folks listening. Yeah. It's truly fascinating, and I think it's what makes the wine unique because climate wise, it's not super different other than, you know, the South is much, much hotter than the Northern part of Sardinia. Obviously, you have the maritime coastal influence, but a lot of the valleys and the mountains are what influence different regions, I would say, whether that's, you know, blocking maritime influence or drawing it in. That it's kind of hard because there's so many different name names that people probably wouldn't even understand. But, yeah, there's a lot of different mountain ranges that kind of dissect different regions. So if we start, like, in the Northwest, you have Alguero, which is like a coastal area that is a very popular tourist destination. There, you're gonna have a lot of, like, Fermentino and Canigliari. I think they have their own DOC. Sardinia actually has 18, I think, DOCs. Wow. Just on the island. Yeah. And there's only one DOCG, which is Vermentino De Gallura. And Gallura is, like, the northeastern top corner. Okay. And there, you have a lot of, like, granite. And that's why the the wines there are very, like, fresh and elegant. Even the reds there are super, like, lively and kind of more finessed. And that's the only DOCG that Sardinia has, but mountains of granite. It's beautiful. Got it. Like, white rocks everywhere. It's gorgeous. Yeah. And for just really quick for those that are listening, I know in an earlier episode, I'll have talked about the DOC and DOCG, what that is. So it's a classification of Italian wine. And, essentially, I kinda think of it as like a pyramid where, like, at the very top is your DOCG. These are typically, like, your highest quality wines. And if anything, they have the, like, the strictest rules is the way I understand it. And then just below that are the DOCs, which similarly good quality wines usually specific rules they have to follow, but just not considered quite the top tier that DOCG is. %. Exactly. And then you get if you go down, like, the coast of Sardinia on the Eastern Coast, you have, like, Barbaja is a big, bigger zone, which is like Mamoyada. That's kind of more inland to the from the coast. You also have Dorgali in that area. I think Ollena. So those are areas that are really famous for quinoa now. And Sardinia, if you've seen, like, in any wine news, like Barbaja, Mamoyada, especially, has gotten a lot of press coverage lately. And there they have, I think, a lot of it depends on which area you're in again, but I think the main one there is decomposed granite. And then they also have a lot of basalt, I think you would say. It's like, old volcanic soil. Okay. So really complex. And again, a lot of mountains, a lot of valleys. So you have a lot of microclimates to check out and explore. And going wine tasting there to discover Canada is interesting because you can kind of get the nuances of the different areas. And then going down, you have Oliastra along the coast. There are wineries there. I I'm not as familiar with that zone, so I can't really tell you as much about the specific geography. The South Of Sardinia is really famous for, Quiragnana di Soltis. So Quiragnan is the grape, and Soltis is an area that has a lot of sandy soils. So if you go there and taste, it's really interesting because you'll find a lot of own rooted vines. So vines that haven't been planted without any American rootstock that were never touched by phylloxera. They're really great wines. Oh, I also skipped one of my favorite areas before Olyastra's Mandralizai mountainous area. All of the wines there are blends of Quenonau, Beauvale, and Monica. So those are three really good red Sardinian varieties. And what's unique there is that the grapes have to grow in the vineyard together. They're not like a separate vineyard. Oh. Yeah. Are they, like, field blended then as well? Like, when they when they make them cut? Together, vinified together, everything. So that's actually one of my favorite Sardinian wine regions. And then there's a bunch in the middle of Sardinia too. I'm kinda just doing the coast because it's a little bit easier. But I think my one of my favorite wines in Sardinia is Vernaccia di Orsano, which is on the Western Central Coast right on the water. They're really famous for their seafood there. So if you want good seafood, go there. And that is the only wine in Italy that is made in an oxidative style under floor. So kind of like how sherry is made. Yep. Okay. Very cool. Different taste, different style, really, really special wines. So those are kind of like the big ones. There's also Malvasia Di Boza, which is on on that same Western Coast. There's so many. I think there's, like, 80 different indigenous varieties in Sardinia that they've discovered, and they're still uncovering more. Something like 60% of the vines in Sardinia are they call it alberolo sarda, which is the bush trained, so gobble, which means that they're not, like, on trellising. They're just individual vines that actually look like a little bush or tree. So they have a lot of historic vineyards there that hopefully people will keep. We've been seeing, like, new like, all these young winemakers are wanting to, like, get rid of it. Like, that those vines are still producing great grapes. Like Yeah. Get rid of it. That's what, like, makes it special. Like, as soon as you take it out, it just becomes like another region, and that's not Exactly. Keep it special. Why would you Exactly. Exactly. I know it's, like, harder, and it's probably Yeah. You can't get as many of the grapes out. It's all like a you know, if you wanna make money, I guess, I could see maybe. I know. But it's, I mean, I feel like the whole as a whole, the wine industry, I know people need to make money, but also you need to keep what is like special and historic and makes your, like, territory stand out for, you know, what it really has to offer. And I feel like Sardinia does a great job of doing that, but they're less so forward on, like, the marketing and PR side, which might not be bad. I mean, we don't have a lot of their wines in America. And the wines that we do have are a lot of the bigger mass produced wines that aren't necessarily the best quality in my opinion. So hopefully we can change that. Yeah. We'll talk about how you're gonna change that. It sounds like very exciting in a little bit maybe, but, I wanted to hit on, and then we talked a little bit about the grapes that come from these regions. Just for folks that are kinda listening, I think a lot of people, especially from The US, and even, even just like North America, think of wine in terms of grapes more than they do regions, right? Versus like Italy kinda thinks of and Sardinia would think of region wise. So we've talked about Canada now a little bit. Can you share a little bit more about kind of like what people should expect from this grape? And then what are the other, like, if you were to think of the main grapes of Sardinia that you'd find, maybe like the top five or so? Sure. Okay. So Canada now is like a super approachable red wine. I mean, if you like Grenache, I know you'll like it, but it it can be like medium to full bodied. They're honestly a lot more full bodied than Sardinia because it gets hot there. So they're pretty intense. Especially these days, you'll find them to be a little bit higher in alcohol, like usually around 14%. A lot of concentrated red fruit flavors. So like cherry, strawberry, maybe raspberry. They have what I love about them is they have the macchia aroma, which is like the Italian word for wild shrubs and brush. Because if you go to Sardinia, you'll see that there's, like, juniper and, the words are only coming to me in Italian and I they're not gonna make sense. It's gonna be like rosemary, lavender. I know those are more Southern Rhone, maybe. Yeah. Those are more Southern Rhone. No. Like, a myrtle myrtle. They call it's Myrtle there. It's like a type of berry, but basically fragrant, the same idea. So you get that quality in the wine. It's super high acid, so really great with a lot of different foods. Maybe you'll have, like, a little bit of, like, dried orange peel or whatnot. But again, depending on where you get it from, what the it can be much more concentrated with a lot of, like, depth, a lot more richness. It can be a little bit more, you know, elegant, lighter in style. So it just depends where you're gonna find it. But one thing I will say to the listeners is what y'all see on the label is Cano now di Sardinia. That's the DOC, the re the region, but that covers the whole island. So it doesn't just cover one specific area. So you really need to kind of figure out where the winery is and, like, do a little due diligence and read about the producer to get a better understanding of what kind of style I think. Sure. Are some of those subregions that you mentioned, will they be labeled by that subregion, and could those also be Cannanau, or is most Cannanau labeled that Cannanau Dysartania? The one that comes to mind is Mandrillizai. That's the doc. That's the DOC. But those will not be a % cannanal. Got it. Okay. It's 3030%. Like, Arbogia, I don't think that they have a DOC, but they have an IGT, which is like if what you're talking about, the pyramid would be at the base of the pyramid with the loosest restrictions. So if you see something that says IGT, that could also be a region, but not voice. Okay. But yeah. So it makes sense. So it looks like you're looking for Cananau Di Sardinia, but just pay attention to where because it could be literally anywhere on the island. Right. I think Vermentino is the big other huge Sardinian variety. It's a white variety. They say that the best area according to the regulations would be Galura, which there are a lot of fantastic wines there. Vermentino and Sardinia, again, it depends, like, who produced it and where, because now we are getting a lot more styles that might have been, like, influenced by oak or fermented in oak or gone through batonnage. So they're a little bit more creamy rather than that, like, fresh style. But it really is a fantastic white wine, especially for summer. It's fresh, high acidity, a lot of citrus, like that bitter almond kind of finish. Really great. I love, Engalura. I love Agricola Sasso and La Contralda and a bunch of others. So if you want tips, just message me. Find me on Instagram and I can get you tips. What are some others? Let's see. Canulare is one of my other favorites. I don't know if it's like one of the most popular, but I'm gonna represent it because I love to drink it. And that is mostly grown in the Northwestern corner of Sardinia and near, near Alguero vineyards around there. And it's kind of, it's a inky concentrated red that has a lot more like black fruits, like black cherry, blackberry, those sort of notes. But I love it because it has these really sweet tannins. It doesn't taste sweet. It's not like a sweet wine, but the tannins aren't aggressive. They're very I don't know how else to describe it. Sweet tannins is what I get. And then you get a lot of like herbs, a little bit of maybe like minerality, very unique, but high quality delicious. I think Monica is the other really big red in Sardinia. I don't know that you'll find a lot of it bottled on its own though. It's it has a high number of plantings, but it's often used as like a supporting grape for other red wines. I know like in Mandreloziah, a couple producers in that specific region, you can find it if you wanted to try it as a school. I have tried it, but I think, yeah, I've only ever seen one bottle. Maybe it's Monica. Yeah. I mean, at least over here in The US. Right. I don't know if I could describe it very well. So, I mean, I would advise you to look that one up, but I do think it's kind of the same. I mean, it's definitely not as full bodied when it's bottled on its own. I'd I'd say it's like a medium bodied, you know, red fruits. It doesn't have as much of, like, that herbaceous macchia quality that Sure. Other Italian reds might usually have. Vernaccia, I love. And it's one of the DOCs, Vernaccia di Orsano. It's the wine that's aged oxidatively, but they also I think they pretty much I mean, there are bottlings where it's just been applied as a white wine, but the quality is that oxidative style. It's super special. For anyone that listening that doesn't know it, the floor is a natural yeast that's found on the grape skins. And it's one of the only varieties in Italy that has that. So they don't need to add anything during fermentation. The, and then the yeast is unique because it switches from consuming oxygen and turning that into, you know, c o two and alcohol to make wine to then, like, floating up to the top once fermentation is done, and it kind of creates a barrier on the top of the wine that protects it from oxygen while it's still consuming. It's very complicated. I wrote a whole article about it. I'm not explaining it well now. So I will send you the link to that if anyone wants to read about it. It's a super unique wine. It's definitely one of those things that I feel like is, like, one of those complicated parts of wine where you're just, like, you have to, like, learn about it three, four, five times until you're like, okay. I kinda get it now. Yeah. Like, you just like It's something like the mechanism. It's like, I I can't it's like aerobic to anaerobic is the Okay. Whatever switches Yeah. And how it it after fermentation. But, yeah, we'll have to look at We're not we're not scientists. It's fine. It's fine. We know wine and grapes. Right? Well, I wanna give you a chance too to highlight. You planted a whole vineyard. You're starting your winery. What grapes do you plan to make wine out of for your winery? We have four five four grapes, I think, for the most part that we planted. Our mountain site so our vineyards are in the area of Goceano, which is like Central Northern Sardinia. So mountains. They're not up high. They're in the mountains, but we're not like at the peaks, you know. Mhmm. The village of Vanilla, if you look that up, you can see on the map where the vineyards are. We planted one vineyard in the mountains and that's where we planted a white variety that's indigenous to that area in Sardinia. It's called Arvezyniadu. So Arvezyniadu. It's very complicated. And in Sardinia, they have like all these different dialects of Sardau. So people say it differently depending on where you are. Anyways, it's a white variety that's really special. They've also found out that it's similar to Renata has the floor. Ah. So potentially there's opportunity to do one like that, but it's super complex and it's a variety that's kind of having a resurgence right now in Sardinia. So a lot of different styles happening. So it's kind of hard to describe one way. But for me, I get a lot of, you know, citrus, hay, maybe a little bit of honeysuckle. It also with age kind of has that quality like Riesling where almost like, petrol aromas. Yep. Yep. K. So it's that sort of style, but it can also be very high alcohol. So you need to be careful with the when you harvest and winemaking as well. And then we planted only reds in the valley site because it's much hotter there. And we planted Keanu now, bovale, or muristelu is what they call it in Sardinia, which is another red I should have mentioned before. It's bold, big, like a lot of potential, I think, with Bovale. And a little Monica and a little Pascale, which is another red variety in Sardinia that they use too, usually for blend. So we'll probably do, like, a a Bovale single varietal wines and then also a blend of everything, but we kind of just have to see how Right. You're like, it mostly doesn't know what the grapes are like. We'll see if there you can have a plan, but who knows if that plan comes to fruition. Fruition. Exactly. So we'll see. Hopefully, if the growing season goes well this year, we'll have at least some grapes that we can kind of start to experiment with and get a better idea of what we wanna do. Yay. Exciting. I hope you enjoyed this episode of the Cork and Fizz Guide to Wine podcast. If you'd like to learn more about Nikki's winery and just more about wine in general from Nikki, first go follow her on Instagram. It is sipwithnick n I k is what that's spelt like. I'll put the link in the show notes. And you can check out her Substack which is very similar to a blog and that is at sipwithnick.substack.com. Again, link in the show notes for you. There is a free version of the Substack but you can also become a paid subscriber to get access to a ton of bonus content. This includes all of Nikki's food and wine guides, things like where to go wine tasting in Sardinia, ultimate guide to wine and cheese pairing, barbecue wine pairings, urban wine pairing guide, like, just got it all. And you will also get access to exclusive content like pairing recipes including some of the blue zone recipes from her Sardinian mother-in-law like how cool is that off the beaten path wine finds and behind the scenes look at her starting her winery in Sardinia As a paid subscriber, you will also get exclusive discounts on dynamic imported wines and wine club offerings through her new company, which she has a name here, but I know she's kind of debating still. So here it is New Road Selections, but I think she might be throwing out some other names on her Instagram. So go follow her there so you can learn more about that. You'll also get early access to their first releases from the winery, opportunities to help shape the winery, and first dibs on winery experiences. And I'm telling you all of this because Nikki is offering a special 30% off annual subscription to Cork and Fizz podcast listeners. So you can just go to sip with nick.substack.com/porkandfizz, and you can get that 30% off the annual subscription to her substack. Highly recommend supporting Nikki. She is absolutely wonderful, and I can't wait to see all of the things things that she ends up doing. Now, if you love this episode as much as I did, I'd love it if you could take a quick second, rate it, leave a review, and if you know a wine lover in your life that would enjoy it, please share it with them. In next week's episode, you'll hear part two of my interview with Nikki, where we talk about her incredible Substack, which I've already mentioned before, but we'll go a little bit deeper into it. Talk about her love for unique and lesser known wine varieties, the new wine import business that she's creating. Plus, you'll discover what thing about wine, what wine myth bugs Nikki the most. Thanks again for listening and if you want to learn more about wine, come follow me at corkandfizz on Instagram. And if you're interested in exploring new wines and joining an incredible community, and and when I say incredible I'm not just like throwing that word out there, this community is like so wonderful and welcoming and I look forward to hanging out with them every single month. We are a community of wine lovers that enjoy tasting wine every month. 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